---
title: "Stamford Select Board — September 5, 2024"
date: 2024-09-05
session: regular
speaker_labels: 1 cluster(s) named from the roll call and that meeting's chair in the minutes, 1 named from roster attendance, 10 of 12 clusters unnamed
voice_ids: {"SPEAKER_00":65,"SPEAKER_01":17,"SPEAKER_02":24,"SPEAKER_03":2,"SPEAKER_04":8,"SPEAKER_05":1,"SPEAKER_09":6,"SPEAKER_10":4,"SPEAKER_11":5,"SPEAKER_12":3,"SPEAKER_13":10,"SPEAKER_14":7}
duration_min: 123
audio: https://townofstamfordvermont.org/mediaItems/Selectboard%20meeting%202024-9-5.MP3
audio_source: town local
minutes: https://townofstamfordvermont.org/mediaItems/Sbd%20Minutes%209-5-24.pdf
minutes_pending: false
present: [Nancy L. Bushika, Michael G. Denault, Kurt Gamari, Douglas Wright, John Dunn]
absent: []
transcribed: 2026-09-04 (faster-whisper large-v3, CUDA; names corrected per data/name_fixes.json)
diarization: pyannote/speaker-diarization-3.1 (automated; cluster labels may over-split a single voice; unattributed paragraphs have no reliable speaker)
---

# Stamford Select Board — September 5, 2024

**Session:** Regular · **Duration:** 123 min · [Audio](https://townofstamfordvermont.org/mediaItems/Selectboard%20meeting%202024-9-5.MP3) · [Minutes](https://townofstamfordvermont.org/mediaItems/Sbd%20Minutes%209-5-24.pdf)

**Present:** Nancy L. Bushika, Michael G. Denault, Kurt Gamari, Douglas Wright, John Dunn

---
And to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Welcome to a meeting of the Stamford Select Board. If you have a matter to discuss that is not included on the agenda, you may do so by addressing the chairperson and stating your name and address. You will notice that all our meetings are recorded, and this is to aid with the summarization of the minutes. Visitors are welcome, and we allow five minutes of comments per visitor and 15 minutes per topic. Discussions will be held in a common, civilized manner and respectful of others. Select Board members present are... Michael G. Denault. Nancy Bushika.

**Speaker 1:** Douglas Wright. John Dunn. Kurt Gamari.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Will there be any adding of items or removing items from tonight's agenda?

**Speaker 2:** I do. Correspondents, six minutes.

**Speaker 3:** Okay.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Will there be any adjustments to the agenda, such as... Just changing the order of items. Okay. Hearing the visitors, Patrick, you're on first.

**Speaker 4:** Hello. Would I be able to stand and talk to you?

**Speaker 5:** Be sure.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** You can stand by Laurie.

**Speaker 4:** Yeah, perfect.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Perfect.

**Speaker 4:** All right. Hi, I'm Pat Kennedy. I was a local, grew up here, kid. I live in North Adams. Hopefully, I will be back in Stamford one day. I have since started a recycling company in Adams, Mass. I'm just trying to work with you guys. We do a lot of the tough to do recycling items. We do mattresses. We do tires. We do any appliance unit or any electronic waste whatsoever. So I do have like a price list thing I can pass along to everybody. I'm just trying to get into Stamford to hopefully make your guys' life easier. Transfer stations cost a lot to run. If I can divert it, great. If I can't divert it, I can come pick it up from you, do whatever you guys need at the most, most cost-effective price. effective way. Massachusetts is a little different from Vermont because you don't have the bands on the mattresses, you still have problems with electronics, you have food's a tricky thing, composting, I can help, I have a friend in that business if the school struggles with that at all. But what I do is mainly mattresses type, all four of those categories. I think I can save you money compared to any other place where you would be able to go and I know there was concern about crossing lines of Vermont and Massachusetts. So the reason that mattresses in Massachusetts go to Connecticut and sometimes they go to upstate New York in a landfill is because of logistics laws transferring over. But me being a certified recycling center, I'm not worried about the logistics and getting that to have no effect on Stamford whatsoever. I'm $45 a mattress where Casella you bring it to Lenox, it's $55. On tires, I'm $8. I'm willing to work with whatever we do, however I can make your life easier, however I can save you guys any money on your budgets because I'm sure that's one of your topics of agenda today. Just something that we do do. I would love to know any feedback where you do struggle. Do you struggle in the transfer station? Or if I can do anything to...

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Patrick, you have a website?

**Speaker 6:** We do.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Oh yes, you do. Okay.

**Speaker 4:** We're working on really upgrading the website as we speak. It's hopefully about two days from launching where the pickup app will be so stinking easy to use. It's step-by-step. Program your name, number. We'll give you a date when we'll come pick it up at your house. So maybe people don't even need to use your transfer station for those bulky things.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** That's what I like. It said you're going to pick them up. So if I have a 10 tires...

**Speaker 4:** So I grew up in the mattress industry. I carried a couple of them in my day. They are not easy to carry. I'm a pretty big human being. I can do firewood pretty well. Not as good as this guy Ken, but I did my fair share of it too. It's just a difficult unit. It's difficult to do things. Mattresses especially, that's where our business concept came into and then since we expanded because Berkshire County is a small logistics area. Westfield has more people than Berkshire County does. It's one of those tricky things where we're looking to expand. Our facility is in full swing with big 8,000 square feet to cut up mattresses. We give tours if you want to ever come take a peek. Make sure that everything's set up the way you guys would like it to be set up.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** That's one thing that I was talking about in your business early in the year and Dr. Kyle, you're actually recycling the mattresses. You're not bringing them somewhere else. You're not bringing them somewhere else. You're actually recycling the mattresses. You're not bringing

**Speaker 4:** them somewhere else. Me too. They are not getting transferred to Connecticut like every other mattress in, well, there's a place in Gardner. That's my closest competition to actually put Santa and then people that do it illegally but, 1500 mattresses we've done in rounds and 1500 mattresses wouldn't fit in this place. I occupy about that amount of space with 1500 mattresses if I've got enough that height to the ceiling so we really reduced the footprint that we're going to landfills. Right now Vermont mattresses go all the way up to New York, upstate New York and get dumped in a mattress just as it is. That takes up a lot of space that's gonna fill up way quicker than anybody wants that to happen. Well, you can take a mattress to the degree.

**Speaker 7:** Right next to that nuclear waste.

**Speaker 4:** Just use it to dig the hole or surround the hole. Mattresses, there's a ton of foam. There's a lot of, I mean, we've got stuff with horse hair in it, so I didn't have a second home for the horse hair, unfortunately. We ideally, we're at 80% now of the mattresses recycled we hope to be. If we can get the toppers gone, find a home for them. If anybody has a creative mind, hey, I'm all about it. If anybody needs some pallet wood, I can drop as much box spring wood off as anybody needs. But I'm just trying to get in and say hi to everybody. If you have a Tom's website, I'm trying to get on that Tom's website of the reference over so maybe just a direct link to our website because websites are making them easy to use for all different ages is a tricky thing and I think we we're really close

**Speaker 5:** to having that. Perfect. Do you have some flyers you could leave outside in the

**Speaker 6:** hallway? I definitely do. I can take a picture of that. Yeah, perfect. I've got one. I'm also a

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But if you want, leave some out on the table out there would be good.

**Speaker 4:** Perfect. I will do that. Any questions for me, anybody?

**Speaker 8:** Would it be worth putting one up on the bulletin board if you didn't have to dump for people who are needing a resource for mattresses?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** There's no, it's not a competition for us at all because we lose money at our, no matter where they go, it's a good thing for us.

**Speaker 4:** Every time that we want to, they, transfer stations cost a fortune to occupy. I'm not trying to aggravate anybody's job. It's just the things that we do are a pain in the butt to do. It's not trash.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I think, you know, at the recycling center and maybe out, there's a bulletin board out right on the school wall and it says, not town, not school, but there's other news or something. Other flyers could go there. People might see it there.

**Speaker 4:** Definitely.

**Speaker 9:** Are these prices with the free outage?

**Speaker 4:** We take the free on out. That's what, that's what, that's what.

**Speaker 10:** For an AC unit? Yep. With the free on. Yep.

**Speaker 4:** If the free on is out of it, it's scrapped.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So I like to look at, I don't know what the transfer station's taking in now, but look at, okay, well, people might not want to go down to Adams because we do take a lot of that. Yeah. But if you said, all right, well, every month I'm going to come up and say, here's a. You know, 20 air conditioners that we took down and we charged X amount of dollars. You charge.

**Speaker 11:** I don't want to lose money, but I mean, if he's taking them for cheaper than what we're charging now or the same, I would say for his efficiency, if he's up here at this point, I don't see anything on his list that we shouldn't just say, Hey, you want to grab it?

**Speaker 12:** Right. If he's coming to get a refrigerator from somebody up here a month ago up to the recycling center, I'm sure there's something sitting there he can take.

**Speaker 4:** I'm playing on one day a week doing a local North Adams suite.

**Speaker 12:** Stamford, you know, right now there's a bunch of tires there and I can tell you his price is way cheaper. Right.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So we're paying, we're just writing a check to their company instead.

**Speaker 4:** I have a W-9. I have proof of insurance. Everything will be tracked. So your numbers will be accurate when your time. The mattress bands come into Vermont, Massachusetts. They're not strict on it. People are still getting away, bringing them over the borders. That's, that's what we're working on shutting down right now. So they don't go to a landfill. And. There's a lot of hours, but I worked a lot of hours of my whole life. This isn't, this is nothing new to me.

**Speaker 12:** What's the tire, what's the tire, eight bucks, eight bucks. Yeah. The last few men we've ever retired, they sell a couple of them there at 30 bucks a piece. So to be quite honest with you, don't go pat that.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Geez.

**Speaker 12:** I'm just saying, if you want to swing a few of the tires, feel free.

**Speaker 4:** They might be one of my customers is all I'll say on that. All right. So I, I'm here. We're not going anywhere. I love it. I love to save you guys money, make your life easier. I'm a phone call away with, with, with anything. Uh, you can call me, Hey, I'm getting way too full up here. Like you, I don't see Stamford filling up your transfer station in a day, but Hey, I'll do a recycle event. If you want me to do up there, right. Right. I have the, whatever could be easiest. The problem we find is nobody has trucks anymore. Gas is expensive. Trucks are expensive. So the pickup idea makes it easier for everybody not to have three lawnmowers on their board. I mean. Propane tanks. We can do now anything question, give us a call. We'll, we'll make it happen. Sure. If, if we can, there's an avenue. I think we're definitely going to work. Please do. I, I appreciate any word that spread where a year and a half.

**Speaker 13:** Then I also want to know what, what do you do with the mattresses?

**Speaker 4:** Yeah. So we actually take them right in house. We, we cut them all apart. We're. We're always looking for volunteers for hours too. Um, I can even pay you. It's just the guy, my competition, this guy can cut 76 mattresses in a day and he makes 16 bucks an hour. So I'm like, well, I'll pay him 20 and bring him up here. Um, yeah. So yeah, I'm just trying to make my feet. So we, we cut it up. Take it all apart. The fabrics that I would love to show you in house, what we do. So it starts with, you know, up against the wall, put it on our table. My kids are my cutters and, uh, my partners, my partners, workers are, we're working on getting a couple of employees. Now, um, a couple more employees now that they're going to school now. So they can get their education. Sounds like he's got some labor there. Child slave labor. Whoa, whoa. You ever, that was when I grew up where 1999 for the best pair of money can buy. Now the ones they want are $150 and you're like, well, you're not getting those. So yeah, whatever you want now, you're just going to work for it. So they get cut up home, get separated. The metal goes to the scrap yard and the phone, I had to sell them 22,000 palm increments to get rid of it. So it's not an easy gig, but, uh, and I might get lunch money after we get it. It's more. It's going. It goes with second use. It's not the profit on the cell on the phone. It's like the second use where it goes to, it doesn't go to a landfill, but it's getting used. It's getting used. Ideally, if you find anybody who can, so I want to make dog beds.

**Speaker 14:** I would love to make them my pillow.

**Speaker 4:** People spend more money on their dog than they do on their, on their, my pillow for themselves. So a nice quality memory foam dog bed for your bed made from the virtues would be a great thing. But, uh, thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Thank you. So, uh, yeah.

**Speaker 6:** Leave your flyers out there.

**Speaker 4:** Yeah. I'll leave them up there. Thank you so much. Hopefully we'll see you guys. All right. Take care of that. Thank you guys.

Right.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Um, any other visitors?

**Speaker 15:** Yeah. Well, I was hoping that this agenda would have been, uh, or would have been an agenda item. Um, I brought this up about two years ago and just brought it up again. I emailed Nancy. A couple of weeks ago. There has been a tremendous amount of traffic going up, um, mill road, county road. They've started the high tensions and, um, you said you weren't aware of it. So right. Right. What is the town doing to help get money to fix the road that is turning, excuse me, to ship? It's this county road. It's counting. Mill road is awful. At this point, it's a disaster. You can't believe Dave, you can probably attest to this. You can't believe the traffic and they, they have the caution signs partway up the road, not even at the beginning of the road. So you come up that road and you've got an 18 wheeler coming down to get their second or third or fourth load of the blankets that they put, which I think is at hot pins right now. Why weren't we notified? Why weren't the residents notified? How are we going to get money for, excuse me, how is, how are all five of you going to interact with these companies to get money to fix this road? I'm pretty sure what is it five an inch every year is the normal degradation of, of a dirt road. Right now. We have washboards that are literally hopping you across the road. I'm pretty sure we were notified. It must be recent. It's awful. Cause I was up there a week ago. Well the last couple weeks they've been doing this.

**Speaker 16:** Is that anything to do with?

**Speaker 1:** Guys, why don't we notify? Why, why don't we have notifications down that mill road? I'm pretty sure we had the same forestry people here telling us we were going to see some

**Speaker 15:** things coming and going. And they said they would notify us. Nothing. And they. And they did say when it starts they would notify us.

**Speaker 1:** No.

**Speaker 17:** And it's not.

**Speaker 1:** Riggs Dittler did provide a over the road use permit. And they did. And they did.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** And they did.

**Speaker 18:** And they did.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** And they did. And they did.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** And they did. And they did.

**Speaker 19:** And they did.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** And they did. And they did provide a over the road use permit. Yep. I'm assuming. And we do have their insurance.

**Speaker 15:** So that's on file. But this is a national program. There's got to be fines. There has to be. This is a great opportunity to fix mill road. Cause right now. You're out of money. How are we going to fix mill road?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So I. I don't know about the funds. Because we. We've had. We've had people up there before. And we've never received. Funds. You have to go back. I don't know. I don't. Excuse me. What. I don't know if. We are. In that position. To. Demand. Funds. If there's a. If there's a. A program. That'd be one thing. But. I'm unaware of any programs. At this point. That says. Hey. If you have. Projects going up there. We've had projects for years. Up there. And never received any funds.

**Speaker 12:** I would. I'm not aware of anything. Either. I mean. This is. We get state funding. The. Truckers pay. Fuel tax. Road use tax. And that's where. A lot of this. Money comes from. That we receive. I would say. From the state. Right. It's hard to say. Who's causing. Damage. I mean. Right now. It's been dry. For months. I mean. I've certainly seen the road. Worse. Than it is. At the moment. I would have graded it. Already. You know. Where it's a nice. Soft rain. But if I graded it. At the moment. It would be worse. In two days. Than it is now. It would just be loose. So. Yeah. It'd be. It'd be nice. I mean. I can't imagine. How much money. They're going to spend.

**Speaker 20:** Up there.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** They could throw. You know. Some at us. It'd be nice. If you can. Find a way. To do it. Great. Is there anybody. You could check. With your contact.

**Speaker 12:** In Bennington. Yeah. That's. Certainly see some residents. Going up and down. As much. You know. In a week. As. Probably these trucks are. During the day. If I could. If I could point out. That they were actually. Causing damage. I think I'd be down here. Trying to. Right. Invent you. To go after them. But. I don't think. That we have a case. At this point.

**Speaker 11:** Other than.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Well that's what I'm trying to say. There's no program. In place. It's easy to say. Let's get some money. But there's no. You can't just go up. And extort someone. And say. Hey. We want you.

**Speaker 11:** Give us money.

**Speaker 12:** Before you bring. Your trucks up there. I mean. When. On the class four row. The Velco. Did put some money. In there. But it was further. Because they decided. That the row. Wasn't good enough. For their travel. Right. And wanted to. Make it better. Which. Great. I mean. I'm certainly. Not. Going to do them. Any favors. At this point. Most rows. In town. Right now. They're getting washed. For it.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Because we've had. Leaks. And no rain. And. What it does. Does concern me. Is. They did come here. And they did say. We will be doing it. But not yet. And now. They're doing it. And I was. Under the assumption. Or. Not an assumption. I heard them say. When we start. We'll notify you. It was a delay. For some reason. Yeah. We delayed it. So we could. Upgrade our road.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** When you're done. Was this.

**Speaker 20:** National force.

**Speaker 12:** That said that. Yeah. I was going to say. I think there's two different things. Going on here. Instead of asking for funding. There's a lot. I think. We're going to notify. But this is a totally separate. And this is all private. But it wasn't national.

**Speaker 21:** This is the.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** This is the high line.

**Speaker 12:** The power line. Oh. Okay. I thought it was the. I don't think we were ever notified.

**Speaker 22:** By. The national grid. I don't know. Yeah. I talked to them. They were. With the contractor. That they. Okay. Yeah. You know. By the upper bridge. Straight in. The stream.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah. They were in there. So when they do. Give us their. They ask for a permit. They give us their insurance. And I mean. Like you said. If there's a problem. That there's. Excessive damage. Then we could. We could go after.

**Speaker 23:** Dave.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Start. Can you start taking pictures. Now. Just to have. The road. Now. Just to have them.

**Speaker 20:** On file.

**Speaker 12:** I mean. I could take pictures. But. Yeah. Who did it.

**Speaker 1:** I mean. Yeah. Who did it. Yeah. That's right. Who did it. A lot of the washboarding. Is from spinning. The tires.

**Speaker 10:** Is. Right. It's like hopping. And spinning. Pickups. Pickup truck. Yeah. Speed is an influence on that. Yeah. I mean. Once again.

**Speaker 24:** The conversation.

**Speaker 12:** The roads. Just in general. Could. I mean. There's no traffic on it. What you got to remember is. At some point. There isn't going to be a gravel pit in town. Right. You're going to end up with more traffic on that road. It's already. We really can't keep it nice all the time. I would say. It's.

Neeson. But. Depending on the weather. I can't always. Make it better. Like. It would be worse. If I try to do something. Around.

**Speaker 12:** Mug season. I mean. The spring time. If you. You start building more houses. Up there. It's just. As time goes on. You know. As time goes on. We really need to start thinking about. Because everything's changing. The work required to do. So now. The maintenance is more. You know. The stone line. Like. I clean the ditches out. Every couple years. Now. Because. You can't get them as deep. Because they need to be stone lined. In the bottom. The gravel. You know. The way the winters are. Have been. I mean. A little conversation. All rain. Or. All dust. Or. You know. It's. It's. It's.

**Speaker 25:** It's.

**Speaker 10:** It's not a big deal. Our whole conversation. When it comes to. The town plan. Always revolves around. Superficial stuff. Or. Nonsense. Right. We never get into the. Hard core crux of. What it is that we're planning for. In the future. You don't have a total. Like roads. Take like. A 30 second conversation. Like. Oh yeah. We got roads. Yeah. We never really get into.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** What. How we land out the plan. The problem is. Where's the funds going to come from. You look at these programs. And these. They're always. to match that we can't even afford to match a million dollars a mile we wouldn't be able to afford a 20 match next we have townspeople complaining about there's taxes going up now that's going to raise taxes you can look at it but i don't see where the money's going to come

**Speaker 12:** here's here's part of the thing we talked about hiring more people right well take some of the maintenance away and i don't need more people so your average employee is going to cost you 100 grand a year right your million bucks is in 10 years at least 15 or 20 on that road we have to start looking for so so there's your money right there to at least do that million i'm saying right yeah yeah nine nine-ish years i'm probably out of the picture anyway if i make a deal well right so then

**Speaker 21:** you know i always wonder if problems if you know people have talked about mill road over and over

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** about finding a different access if you put a blacktop road up there but you have a banking that's gonna you know slide someday you know that's coming is it worth putting the money into the the road or find an alternative you just and i wouldn't know i'm not an engineer i wouldn't even come close to knowing what you're

**Speaker 12:** about to clean up the slides up the 90s we're not the slides the cheapest i mean we need higher ground you know just to try to widen out the rest of county road and klondike is going to cost you more than a paving you know if you try to follow the code and standard right laura laura's got a

**Speaker 26:** question is there any cost analysis um each road how much you put in each road so you can figure out how much you would actually want to try to budget for piece by piece per year i mean how do you know a lot of the a lot of that is dependent on how

**Speaker 10:** how much are we going to develop and where are we going to develop right which roads are we what type of weather we had that particular year we need to have a humongous conversation as a town of you know what is it that we're doing and what is it that we want to do we write this town plan five people read it it gets thrown in the door and then we write another one in eight years yeah i mean they'd need to be bigger conversations to where we're going as a town oh we want to develop or not

**Speaker 27:** develop this town and where's the money well we said we just bought a new truck and we bought a

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** used loader and we had all we could do to pull a trigger on those things then we bought a fire truck and we had all we could do to pull a trigger on that these are numbers so these are just to keep we're not getting any better we're just keeping up you know we have to have that new fire truck because the old fire truck eventually he's not going to be there anymore or that new loader was it wasn't even a new loader it was a huge new loader because we had a 30 year old loader that dave couldn't even fix anymore and and so on so we can look at a budget we can look at budgeting for certain just like we budgeted for that five hundred thousand dollars worth different than ten million is a you know a lot of money that's going to be spent on that and we're going to have a lot of money that's going to be spent on that and we're going to have a lot of money that's going to be spent on that and we're going to have a lot of money i'm just saying we we could look at it i think the only way we could do it is a state grant or a federal grant we would have to have some money coming in is there program you know are there programs coming in there right now i don't see

**Speaker 12:** you have a grant right now for east road that's a 200 000 on our grant which is a max grant and those are on that class two roads so the roads we're talking about are class three they don't offer paying grants for those they just finally are starting to

**Speaker 11:** pay for some gravel through the clean water act now on the other hand is is every year it's going

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** to go up so if we don't do it today like kurt's saying every eight years you throw it in the door if we don't do it today we don't do something this year then 10 years from now it's not going

**Speaker 10:** to be cheaper that's for sure i mean i think vermont's going to be hit really hard one of the hardest hit states when it comes to as far as development and access and roads i mean you're dealing with a very rural state right that's been dirt roaded for a long time i think it's going to be hard for a lot of people to move into right now so i think i think it's going to be a really hard time that's the third most desirable state in the whole country to move into right now so i mean this is a huge conversation where is all this money going to come from for vermont to turn into something different than what it already is right now and our only source of income is taxation that's your property tax so okay it's difficult and then you know we chose to live in a rural area there's certain consequences i guess that come with living in the rural area in that rural area right and the more and more people that come in from urban areas you know the more and more people that move up the county road the more and more they're gonna come down here and clamor and that they want the road paved you know because the road's paved where i come from

**Speaker 28:** right all right all these other things didn't we have bill and jim didn't we have years ago

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** an article about paving the shore road and that got shot down at town meeting yeah before that we

**Speaker 29:** had a bond issue that goes back a while maybe over 20 years and there was a 200 000 bond issue to pave several roads in town and nobody wanted to spend money but it's still not an unreasonable you know at that time it was grant money supporting some of that it's still not an unreasonable thing to bring up but i think it's got to be presented properly at the meeting you hey everybody's going to chip another thousand fifteen hundred dollars a year

**Speaker 10:** in taxes how much the percentage of this town lives on route eight what's the percentage that's going to vote no on that right off the bat right because they live more about it like forget it high roads that's the nature of the environment that we live in now nothing's done anymore for the benefit of the community right everyone thinks very individual but they want their own

**Speaker 15:** here yeah i would like to just get back to my original comment i really think it's up to the board to contact whoever is doing this to find out what the remediation is going to be and so right

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** away when you said it was a national thing but then you said it was a national national grid

**Speaker 15:** it's a united states program to upgrade the infrastructure of all the power lines so yes it's mandated by the state or the the it's nationally mandated so this has to be done they have to have funds in there for remediation of roads there has to be it's but we don't know and the fact that they've just taken over the road literally if you've got a truck coming at you especially where tetro is what are you going to do and there's no warning we haven't been notified that's what i'm saying i i'm i'm blown away that this isn't a bigger deal than what i'm not just complaining about the condition of the road this is a safety thing yes and with all these trucks going up and down adding 88 80 tons some of these trucks i mean there was a big forwarder going up there the other day i couldn't believe it you can't get around these things and there's no signage nothing they just take over our roads we have the ability to shut down that road until they can come to us and say listen this is the plan guys wonder if they just decided to do this on east road and all of a sudden you couldn't get you couldn't get by east road would you guys would be complaining and if you knew nothing about it this is a big deal we have one way in one way out that's it right i really think this needs to take some sort of priority i'm happy to do it but i'm not a town representative so

**Speaker 12:** dave what were you going to say oh no i don't i don't just uh it'd be great if they leave

**Speaker 11:** that know they you know but what's your recourse when they say no go further you know they could at least have

**Speaker 12:** cars in front there there he goes over all of theAB drop of lights going on all day long all day i mean some of them you know sections of the road you're you're going to have to stop when they're coming off the bell it'd be nice to get some kind of one you get them to require a flag not everybody's taking it easy coming down there

**Speaker 15:** either so no they're not the i saw the one of the rigs trucks go by old county road just fishtailed all the way around the all the way from the bridge down i don't know have they

**Speaker 30:** started so is there is there a contact person did they give us that's i agree with you

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** you know i agree that we should have known that this is the first i heard that they're up there i knew that i heard about the national forest doing the logging right but not the but not the high

**Speaker 15:** well two years ago i i think i came to the board and i said listen this is this is coming because they got lost now which road are they going up stamford pond road they're going up um 264 yeah and and they're also going up i guess through maltese they're okay working in phases and i think pole 129 through 120 right now so they go over to maltese oh and they have a 45 foot bridge going over rolling ground right now and the roaring road where you're up yeah you times the forest service yeah if you keep going and i don't know laura you may want to bring this up with the atv years but the traffic has been unbearable going up there right now yep every day 264 yep behind our seeking house

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** so I mean if they have a contact person you can reach out to them say you know we've had some complaints and we need to see you at our next meeting and no longer you know you couldn't if we have the ability to tell them no don't do work until then and ask them you know do you have flagging what do you have a place for safety is there any provisions for road repairs I mean I don't know what you say when I when I said because I am I'm very very ignorant of the fact that this is happening if you if we say and they say go to hell who's the person we go to next well that's what I'd like to know you know if somebody tells you

**Speaker 31:** to go to hell for that for that they might say those words yeah you wouldn't

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** have to let me know if they say that to me I mean don't worry about it okay all

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** right we can look into this and see what Thank you can happen anything else with visitors regular minutes of August 15th and I

**Speaker 32:** have a motion to accept them as written motion second all in favor

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** road conditions Dave

**Speaker 12:** The tree works been completed from the storm that we had earlier in the summer They finished up last week

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** On East Road?

**Speaker 21:** Yeah

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** You know I got asked did they cut the trees down on top of them?

**Speaker 12:** No they're supposed to get back and have them priced but they're so busy that you know he hasn't done that but I'll follow up with them Okay Once I get their bill to make sure everything's good there How many days it taking? Um it's hard to say because they didn't put full days in Okay Ben They used it as a filler so maybe two whole days you know maybe 16 hours it took them total I'm thinking It's hard to say because they wasn't right there when they showed up and they wasn't right there when they left But um our Freightliner, one of our Freightliners is still in Westminster getting some transmission work done to it So I'm down that truck Um we've been working on ditching all along Midland County I don't know if you've been up there but the whole entire road we've ditched in the last couple weeks We've been steady at that Um yeah things are getting bumpy but it's been at least three or four weeks of not really much for real

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I haven't been up there in a week but last time I was up there I didn't think it was that bad I mean I'd seen a lot worse

**Speaker 12:** It's definitely getting, well you know the normal spots get bumpy but as summer goes on There's a length cycle to the entire road in a way cause then I'll regrade the entire road here before winter hits

**Speaker 11:** Yeah I mean it is dry

**Speaker 12:** Yeah it's been dry and there's not much Loose gravel all over the place Yeah it'll be, if I loosen it up now it'll never patch and you'll have a million loose stones Yeah It'll be twice as bad in a day or two so there's no sense in messing with it Um but I assure you as soon as we get the right weather we'll be out grading it

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** By far that's your worst dirt road in town right? I mean because of the traffic

**Speaker 12:** Well I would say LaSure Hill is equally as bad Yeah You know you got Jepson, LaSure and Mill Road, County Road are you know constantly grading They're always on my mind, they're always on the list

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** The thing with Mill Road and County is people From out of state go through there all the time

**Speaker 12:** Yeah in the summer time it's extremely busy people drive like it's you know the main highway

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** It's a fun ride You know what you're saying the four wheelers they're not on the main road you're saying they're up by your house

**Speaker 15:** They must be going by your place so they come kind of from the county and then they go up

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** But not a lot though right? I mean I haven't seen a lot and the wardens are up there constantly Much better than it was I mean constantly they're up there

**Speaker 31:** Well it's every day they're behind our house every day

**Speaker 15:** Is the power company ATVs?

**Speaker 33:** Every day

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Is it on your land?

**Speaker 15:** No no it's the forest service road

**Speaker 34:** Is the power company on ATVs because they have them all the time

**Speaker 15:** They don't I did ask them and they are not the perpetrators

**Speaker 34:** Well I also do know that you can't get from Woodford over to Reef Road because the forest service took out them U.S. 73 Yeah that's going to be helpful Yeah

**Speaker 35:** I mean if I can't the roads have gone way down

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I mean ATVs you don't see them on the road I can't get from Nobody wants to register to go through all that stuff you know there's nowhere to ride so why do it?

**Speaker 12:** Some of these road issues aren't just a summer thing though Middle Road, LaSure Hill, Jepson Hill are winter issues too I mean on a paved road it's a lot Easier especially after the storms over you know you've got a summertime road more or less nowadays on a paved road where On these gravel roads I would say I can't get enough sand they are sanded every single day On bright sunny days sometimes it's the worst because the sand drops through the ice pack and you know You're not even thinking about it you're going down the road and people go off the road on a perfectly nice day you know Yeah So like I said it's When you're the one dealing with it constantly with our small workforce of Michael and myself you can see where Yeah if you had a bunch of money it would solve all our problems but we need to start thinking ahead because like I said at some point You're not going to be able to get material local Yeah So now the cost is going to just be ridiculous the amount of scheduling like it's just going to be a huge burden at some point to have these gravel roads At least some of these hills

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Could like you do a you have on Jepson you have some black diamond in terms of dirt is it Would it make any sense at all to say okay we're going to look at what it costs to go I don't know say from the town garage to Tager Road And say okay we do that first part stop I would say

**Speaker 12:** Or is it better just to go all the way The efficiency in winter is going to be extremely affected by that if you're going to pave that you need to at least go where Steve Mullis is Where it flattens off Or because yeah because the school bus goes to Maltese you may want to bite the bullet and just go that way Anything the school bus is traveling on should be paid Yeah

**Speaker 36:** So Jepson Road

**Speaker 15:** So that's three miles or two it's like three miles isn't it To Maltese Yeah I think it's three total It's two and a half miles to my house

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Okay so that's almost three miles Call it three in there

**Speaker 12:** Yeah Jepson Road ultimately would be nice to pave we could put in for grants but like I said their own max is a $200,000 grant at this point And we just got one we're not going to get one another you know I think the last one we got was probably eight ten years ago It's not the expectation of somebody else paying for this type of stuff is not fair

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So let's just say we had to pay for it who we what kind of companies do you call in and that's it's not a black pack guy

**Speaker 12:** Well all state asphalt so big companies they put it down cheaper than I can go buy it from them typically It's still going to be a huge amount of money but you would take out you'd have to ask the town to be able to take out you know a loan for say 20 years or something Right So we're not yeah it's a huge number but you're probably you know paying for $100,000 out of the year Sure I mean school money goes up that much every year anyway well I mean the sticker shock is what's scary Sure You know but the quality of life is going to be better you know when you have a turnover of employees you're going to have a smoother transition

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So why don't it doesn't cost anything for a quote Right Right so and I'm not saying it's good I understand what quotes are and estimates and all that crap And I know that it's not going to happen this year and it might happen five years from now but if we get a quote or give us some idea If we're all talking about a million dollars but it ends up being two million dollars A thousand miles or ten million I mean I don't know maybe we should reach out to one of these companies and say hey what would it cost to go from this point to this point this is the road you got to widen it you got to brook I mean that's a bad road it's not an easy road to do

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Who would do all the prep you would have an outside company do all this

**Speaker 12:** Yes we were just great at it I mean the thing is you're never going to you're never going to get it to that perfect stage where you should have it paid I mean none of our roads none of our paved roads were perfect roads they weren't brought up to the point where you would really want it It's the northeast you're never going to get it crooked anyway the road moves Right But it's going to be way better than maintaining the dirt road I can tell you in the spring you're just going to

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Now when you maintain east road you put that chip

**Speaker 11:** The chip seal

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Do you do the same thing on All roads Jepson road all the up by bill

**Speaker 12:** Once they're paved you can do that

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So that's a lot more of a Yeah More efficient than

**Speaker 12:** Yeah and so they can also so the base layer could be what they call cold mixes which are a lot cheaper than hot mix They bring in a they did I had them do it one of the first projects we did I had them bring in cold mix or They called it and they set it up at the state garage up there and they made the mix It's not cold it's just a lot it's like 160 degrees instead of like 300 Yeah So it's and then they put that down But that stuff moves that's why our roads hold up so good we do this chip seal and we have roads that move You know so yeah you see the cracking but really that's why our roads hold up a lot better if you just head south a little bit They're all because them roads weren't built either the roads need to be able to move in the northeast

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Well I think you should you know if you don't mind reach out to one of those companies ask for a quote Yep Bring it back to us give us a start because that That's farther than we've done in the last ten years

**Speaker 26:** Okay Well why don't you ask for a hot mix quote and a cold mix quote Well Dave

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But yeah Dave you get me

**Speaker 12:** I have a regular salesman idea we're all kind for all state asphalt

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah let's see approximately what would be the best bang for the buck and just a good just to start the conversation That's a lot of money to swallow like you said so just start the conversation and say And then like Bill said is if you know today when you get the town meeting you got some answers You know this one day of everybody making a decision would be a tough bill to swallow Bill I think But you know if we wait until ten days before we wouldn't be able to answer any questions

**Speaker 29:** You have to do education meetings you have to be able to

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Present it better

**Speaker 29:** Present it better Present it well and if in truth it turns out that the immediate things that you wanted to pay Say they cost two million dollars right now And you look at what the cost of a two million dollar bond is over twenty years And that may be the kind of cost you want to bring to town meeting

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Right like Dave says you tell them hey we want to spend two million dollars that shocks you But we're going to spend you know a hundred thousand over a certain time

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** The school budget was just two million dollars in June

**Speaker 23:** Oh yeah that's a whole March two million dollars

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** And that's that's not going away so when we say well they spend it on the school That's added to what we want to do it's never going to go away You know we talk about it all the time

**Speaker 29:** Yeah but if you're talking about a hundred thousand for twenty years Right Even if that's a hundred and twenty thousand for twenty years Yeah Whatever that common cost Sure yeah

**Speaker 15:** Well I think Yeah Similar to what the fire department did with the truck And you know Dave we've talked about this and I completely understand But in nine years when Dave retires But you're not going to be able to You're not going to get the younger stock in that's going to do exactly what Dave and Mike do I can't imagine you're going to find road crews that are going to come in And maintain Dirt roads You'll have much a much better chance of holding on to somebody Or even if there's going to be a revolving door maintaining a paved road than a dirt road So these this conversation needs to start now And it may not happen for nine years but if we could start saving for it Maybe in six years or seven years it could get paved Meanwhile we've still got you guys But we've got to think of the day when you guys are gone And you've got two new people coming in with all these ideas And they're not going to want to hang around and massage these roads

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** And you don't We'll have to take your word of which dirt road is the best dirt road to start with We already started on Jepson and then it goes to dirt Is it feasible to finish that one Or is it better to go to Mill Road Or is it better to go to Le Cher Road So we have to look at that too

**Speaker 12:** Some of that conversation goes back to what Kurt brought up Where does the town want to expand Where are we going to have more traffic in say ten years My guess is probably everywhere But that move around It seems to be that Is the most likely place to expand But you know you've got Bulger, McGee I mean there's plenty of lots I think on McGee and that area

**Speaker 10:** That could be built on too I mean Mill Road is a scary circumstance really As far as investing a lot of money It is I mean the river is right there And that could happen any time No guardrails The whole road could be just washed away Which is a big problem

**Speaker 24:** The only other

**Speaker 12:** I mean you're going to spend it somehow or another You're going to rebuild that road You're going to keep rebuilding that road Mill Yeah I don't see it not happening I mean there's no other feasible place to say We're going to

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Get up there

**Speaker 12:** Make a better road in there I mean

**Speaker 37:** So David

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Not this point anyway If you could reach out to your contacts And just give us a starting price And suggestions what roads to start with Start a conversation Okay can we move on to highway garage roof quotes Dave

**Speaker 12:** So I got a price from Stevens From Vermont Roofing Company And Vermont Roofing Company is a different product They don't offer the same product as the Stevens Which is what we were looking It's more along the lines of what we're looking to do right now As far as investment with the garage I did call another company And they never returned my call To try to get a different quote on something similar So I only have the one from the Stevens

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So what was the one last meeting Insulation 82,000 Who was that from

**Speaker 37:** That was from Vermont Roofing Company

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Okay And Vermont Roofing Do they do one without insulation No

**Speaker 12:** Okay

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** No they don't offer anything other than that And Stevens was the one last meeting No insulation 38

**Speaker 37:** Right

**Speaker 12:** We're just replacing what's there There's no upgrade But we may be able to upgrade in the future Through grants With Lori and I We had our energy audit done I still haven't seen the results of it But that money's one of those If there's ever money in the future We have information now A shovel ready type project

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah So maybe the thing to do is replace the roof Without the insulation Hopefully we'll get money with energy audit At least repair the leaks that are in there now

**Speaker 12:** Yeah I mean if somebody has another company I reached out to them Like I don't know if I want to say their name They didn't return my call They went to Oxy And they're a pretty reputable company

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Well didn't Oxy turn into Vermont Roofing No

**Speaker 1:** They're not listed there What about those other ones that do like the shingle Yeah I was just going to say

**Speaker 38:** I don't know if they're going to be cheaper

**Speaker 12:** They do a lot of shingling But I've had estimates personally from them That were four times the cost Yeah they're not cheap

**Speaker 39:** Yeah no

**Speaker 12:** So I didn't bother with them This is somebody around Woodford I was trying to keep it Vermont

**Speaker 15:** What about Vermont Home Or do they just do foam insulation They may not do roofing

**Speaker 12:** This was roofing Google roofing in our area And I tried to find people that were close I don't know this guy

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** You want to think about this Or make a decision tonight

**Speaker 40:** Or just put it out there

**Speaker 1:** What is the frame in which you're trying to accomplish this Before winter Next year My

**Speaker 12:** The roof has been pretty bad It's been bad for a while Yeah so realistically we try to get this done They say he now

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Even roofs don't fix themselves

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** They don't Alright Then do we want to make a motion to go with Stevens

**Speaker 1:** Exactly I'd like to make a motion to use Stevens for $38,000 to fix the roof

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Second Do we have a second Second Do we want to discuss this more No Or take a vote Go with it Aye Go ahead Dave And that is coming out of our ARPA money right

**Speaker 12:** Perfect

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So On road conditions we have declassification of .3 mile section of county road I asked last time if we could wait and put the decision on the agenda So everybody knew we were talking about this I mean we did have our meeting probably a month ago And then last meeting it came up again without being on the agenda So now it's on the agenda Do we want to declassify it Keep it as a class 4 road What's your The old Okay Let me go back too And what Mark Tina was here saying too And I kind of looked into it a little bit Where did we go What was our last decision Because it's back and forth back This is another one of those I think we're on the verge of declassifying that last meeting Right

**Speaker 19:** And we

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** We've got a whole long list of lawyer speak Yeah So We're going to have to We're going to have to We're going to have to

**Speaker 10:** We're going to have to We're going to have to We're going to have to

**Speaker 41:** We're going to have to

**Speaker 10:** We're going to have to We're going to have to We're going to have to We're going to have to We're going to have to

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** The just Let the lawyer speak It's very hard to We said at our public hearing We voted to keep it as a class 4 until we got more information And when Mark Tina was here she was saying that Well you maybe can't go on it Or maybe you can't have motorized vehicles on it Once you downgrade it to a trail And then I got some more information about a town What was it Tom Bridge Tom bridge Tom bridge that there for many years they've been in a legal battle with some owners that the town wants to make a section into a trail that goes to that abuts these owners and the owners say you can't do it because the town loses rights and anybody fixing up that road will be trespassing on their private property but nothing has come about of that lawsuit it just went to Superior Court

**Speaker 20:** and then got thrown back down

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** just keep going so I at my opinion is it's a class for road from rums all the over to the pothole line and Dave has to do minimal maintenance of the class 4 road but he feels I believe in talking to him that he wants to give up that point three because we don't do anything over there but I'm thinking if we do something we're just doing part of the road and minimal maintenance on the

**Speaker 12:** class 4 road. I think there's a big difference between that section of the road and the rest of the road.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** My question would be is, we go to the pothole line, where does the pothole line end? At Risky Ranch or down farther? No, right there. Right at Risky Ranch. So the point three covers it all because you once that's a trail you can't get if there if there was more road you couldn't get through it anyways. If you take our grader down there, I'm gonna kill you. You're out. I mean of course not you know, but if it doesn't we're not maintaining it anyways that's the whole point is, we never have, we never will it's just crazy.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Okay so Pond comes over their County Road that's a class four road all the

**Speaker 23:** way over to the Stamford line. I don't know if it is or if it isn't. It is on the map. I don't know what there's is called but maybe it's on the

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** map it is. It's class three and then... it goes into class 4 1.34 miles to the Stamford line so I don't believe they

**Speaker 19:** maintain it either but people do but two people broke up there is a camp there

**Speaker 23:** that they can people drive their jeeps on a trail yes yes yes I believe yes you

**Speaker 37:** believe houses on right so I just want to make sure that we the town don't lose

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** any rights if you want to take your Jeep or you want to take your motorcycle

**Speaker 12:** saying you know you can read through the whole entire thing we're not responsible for means or liability doesn't say you can't you know it right that they're not not that they're not taking the law of their own our man or It doesn't say anything about non-wheeled vehicles, it says we have the, we can control it.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Right, National Forest or four-wheeler ATV people, the whole point of this is you want to use it, but they're not going to put a gate there. They can't, it's not there. Right, right. It's a public right-of-way, but it's a road-wide trail. National Forest has purchased other trails that they have put gates on. They're not buying this, they don't own it, all we're doing is changing the name of it.

**Speaker 12:** The Roaring Brook Road is a town road, part of that's a town trail. Right. National Forest, they can't, they don't block it, right, they block it up higher where they can, but it's not a town. Wiley Mountain Road is a town trail, it's not blocked up there, there's a camp in Stamford on that road, people drive to that camp on that road. National Forest down here is saying they can't do it.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I personally don't understand. I don't understand why they block Sucker Pond Road, that's a trail off-site. I can't doubt. And they do block that, so I don't know why. It's not a public, it's not a public right-of-way.

**Speaker 42:** I think it's because they're doing that work around the sensitive area.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** But they do have camps on that road that are Stamford-owned camps. They should be able to access those camps.

**Speaker 12:** They probably have right-of-way. They have it, they're not public right-of-way.

**Speaker 22:** To what degree, if we keep that as a Class 4 road, what are our requirements? As a town, can't you just, I mean, you haven't been doing anything on it in a while, can we just leave it?

**Speaker 12:** So we've got a lot of these. Because they change things all the time, a few years ago they put in that Clean Water Act. So maintenance, on a Class 4 road, it doesn't say there can be no maintenance. It doesn't specifically say what maintenance. It says to the good and necessity of the town. But drainage is supposed to be maintained. You're not supposed to have the river erosion, especially on a hydronic. It's supposed to be a fairly connected road segment, which some of that's going to be. So we're supposed to at least maintain real erosion, I would say, at the bare minimum. If it's a trail, we don't have any.

**Speaker 22:** How much time would this maintenance you're talking about, how much time would that take to do?

**Speaker 12:** I don't think we could. The banks are so high, and then you're going to get in a fight with National Forest, draining water on their property that hasn't been there. It's got to be four foot, five foot. If there was drainage existing, and we were just maintaining it, and we had prescriptive rights, there's nothing there at this point. It's non-maintainable. It's a creep. It is. Sure. That's exactly where the drain water goes down there. We're responsible for the safety of that road at this point.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So the water's running down that road, goes into Pommel's Class 4 road,

**Speaker 12:** that's their problem.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah, but it's our water.

**Speaker 12:** We're not putting the crossers to the line.

**Speaker 11:** Nature is going to get in there.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** You're not going to jump in the path like you would? But just that one statement, we are responsible for the safety at this point, should make us all jump to the other side and say, let's put it as a trail that takes away that liability. Yeah. It makes sense.

**Speaker 42:** What if they increase the demands on what it has to be, and still, it's going to be on Pommel's Class 4? Then all of a sudden, we're liable for a million dollars. And they will. They're going to eventually.

**Speaker 10:** Yeah. And in the future, if we ever had to do something to that road segment, for whatever reason, it's going to take an awful huge investment anyway.

**Speaker 41:** Right.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** If we had to make a road that would go through there, whether it was a trail or a Class 4, it's not up to a code on a Class 4.

**Speaker 12:** You can bring it back up to a Class 4 if you want later on.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Right.

**Speaker 12:** It's not a mistake.

**Speaker 19:** But you would have to anyways.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But what about the ATV club? How do they feel about it being trail or Class 4? What is this going to hurt them, help them?

**Speaker 43:** It doesn't matter whether it's a Class 4 or being a trail.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I thought you said something about grants or something. You can work.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I think we've determined that last meeting, that the language is all there now. Good. The language that you needed.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** You were going to give us something, some paperwork.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I thought you said it was. I thought you said it was. I thought you said it was. I thought you said it was. I thought you said it was.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** What was the paperwork, Tom? You were going to give us something that you gave us last week and it must have got filed somehow. What was that for?

**Speaker 34:** The paperwork is for a funding grant to maintain that section of Town Highway 12 and that TR301.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Town Highway 12. That's it.

**Speaker 34:** That's the .3 section of Town Highway 12.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Okay.

**Speaker 34:** That's what that's called.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** And that's a grant so who can maintain it? The ATV club? No. And does it have in there that you have to work through with the road commissioner because? Of course.

**Speaker 34:** Oh, yeah, most. This board and the road commissioner.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Both. Unlike the high-tension people. They just get to do what they want. It has to be signed off.

**Speaker 15:** Until the helicopters start coming in. Really? Oh, yeah. They have to replace the poles. Who said they're going to drive them? They're set them, yeah. Yeah, they set them. They're turning them all into little poles. So they're taking up the windows. Okay. They were just waiting.

**Speaker 29:** Somebody make a motion. Make a motion.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I'll make a motion. We change it to, like we said last time, we change two of them. Town Trail. We go Trail. Town, we go Trail. We second.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** All in favor?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Aye. Aye. Aye.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Aye. Aye. Aye.

**Speaker 2:** Aye.

**Speaker 22:** Aye.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.

**Speaker 8:** Aye.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.

**Speaker 13:** Aye.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.

**Speaker 26:** The second part of that is, did you get the key to the gate?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** No.

**Speaker 26:** So Sean Langston said to Martina that, I went down to Stamford today and dropped off keys with Lori at the town office. Yeah. Oh, you did? Yeah. Okay. Just that was a second. Yeah.

**Speaker 2:** Okay, good.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So, who gets the keys? Martin. Does the town? They don't. We don't want them.

**Speaker 12:** I do.

**Speaker 44:** We're pretty fine.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** What do you put them here for? The fire department for you.

**Speaker 45:** Now do we know if, do we know if National, if they gave the fire department keys?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** No. They just dropped off two. They dropped off... Keys.

**Speaker 26:** Keys. Cause there's two locks. So, yeah, it's definitely, that's why I mentioned it. For access for sale.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I know you guys would cut the game. Yeah. Yeah. We don't have that big truck anymore that you just replaced with.

**Speaker 2:** So there's two locks on each side. The same key opens up both locks. So do you want both locks to be given to the fire department? Is there any reason for them to keep a set in the vault or hand them over?

**Speaker 1:** Well, if they both go to the same lock, I would keep one in the office for a spare and then give one to the fire department.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** See if the fire department has one already, but they probably don't.

**Speaker 1:** I don't know. I don't think so, but I don't even know specifically. Are they non-duplicate keys? I'm sure somebody in the department does. Five copies.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Well, if they would get in touch with Laurie. Yep.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Keep one here.

**Speaker 29:** I'll at least get somebody to tell me what it is they want access to. Okay. Or we'll show somebody on the map.

It should go right.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Okay. It's just if someone's up there, though, a hiker or anything, if you guys need to get in that access, it makes sense.

**Speaker 29:** A week and a half ago, we had somebody injured at the new Seth Warner camp. It's a two-hour walk-in.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah, they made it so you can't drive it.

**Speaker 29:** They didn't make any access. Our people had tried with our six-wheeler and a couple of four-wheelers last spring, and they couldn't get through. And National Forest and A-Trail people never showed up to help either. So when this girl got injured, it was just about a two-hour walk-in, and it was a killer because of how steep it is. You're walking the A-Trail. Yeah. And Paul and Corey came back and said, you know, it was more of a rob walk-in. Rob LaMoure walked in with them, and it was mud puddles and rock.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Lots of rock.

**Speaker 29:** A lot of up and down in there. Yeah. Slippery rock. They did get the young lady out, and then she was airlifted. Once they got her off the mountain, she wound up with stitches in her eyelid. Thankfully, it did not affect her eyes. But Paul was filing recognition again with National Forest and the A-Trail of what a situation it is that they've created by moving that camp.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Is that more halfway between Woodford and Stamford Road? Is that why they moved it, or just because it's…

**Speaker 29:** It's further out in the woods. They maintained that it was getting too much use, and the path around it was getting abused and more than that.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So it's not right on the A-Trail itself. It's off quite a bit.

**Speaker 46:** It's on the trail, but it's way…

**Speaker 24:** It's farther down towards Massachusetts.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah.

**Speaker 12:** They didn't want ADVs to get there. Right. Yeah. They didn't want ADVs.

**Speaker 47:** It was too accessible. Yeah.

**Speaker 29:** But they made absolutely no provision for emergency access. Right.

**Speaker 26:** They didn't even stop that.

**Speaker 29:** They're not the ones going there.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So, Dave, on changing that to a legal trail, I noticed on several town maps, not just Stamford, not just Reed, but many town maps, on the section that's unimproved, can we put the letter U, meaning impassable or untraveled, or a designation? I mean, it's on our map there now. We don't have any in Stamford, but most of our trails are passable.

**Speaker 12:** I don't know why I'd have to visit their town and see what their road looked like, why they put that on there.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Can we talk to Ms. Alley and ask why?

**Speaker 12:** I mean, in Hughesboro, I know they've got class four roads that don't look like roads at all.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** And they've got the U that's on the Smith Road between the…

**Speaker 12:** It'd be hard for us to walk through them. Yeah. That might be why they do that. But it doesn't take away their responsibility. I guess so. Because I've had that conversation with the AOT, about that. At some point, it's going to be a contentious thing, because they want these laws followed. And now they're following up on a lot of things that they never used to. I think you're going to see that other towns at some point are going to have to start turning these things into legal trails instead of class four roads. I don't know why they wouldn't.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Class four with a U saying impassable and don't do any work on.

**Speaker 10:** Part of the complications that I was talking about earlier with Vermont trying to come out on roads, ruralism, it's becoming developed. It wasn't really meant to be.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** That's like going from Martell's last… down, that should be a trail. It shouldn't even be a class four. Right. You're not going to grade that.

**Speaker 11:** From Martell's to the Pound of Lime should be a trail.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah. It's a cobbled path. Not even a cobbled road would go down that.

**Speaker 12:** Years ago, it used to be a little better, because the city of North Adams used to allow… Yeah. John to take some gravel deposits on the side of the road, so they used to grab a lot of that and try to keep the road passable so that they could get up to their property for whatever reason. But that's all gone. It's been gone for a long time. And Sir Sossamo walked out there years ago and put a bunch of money in the risky ranch at one point. So usually when somebody does something like that, they put money in the way of roads more than we do. Yeah.

**Speaker 10:** It's kind of a predicament, too, right? And then you start clearing off more of this forest for development to occur, and then you get more and more erosion on the road. Yeah. There's more water coming down the hill. Where's the balance? It's saturating the forest. Yeah. Yeah. And that's where we're going to have issues, too, is when you start clearing large pieces of land for people and buildings,

**Speaker 12:** that it's all going to come down. So you want to… That's part of the plan. Where's the water go from here? Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake.

**Speaker 10:** Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake.

**Speaker 12:** Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake. Lake.

**Speaker 10:** Lake. Lake. It's all coming this way. Even the lower half of Le Cher Road all runs off past the village of Stamford, but anything to the northern end of Le Cher Road goes down to Roaring Brook, and then everything north of Mill County Road comes right down to the village. So, I mean, any development up in there is going to change the hydrology big time.

**Speaker 12:** I mean, just the one house that was built on the lower side of Le Cher Road the last couple summers has changed. Where the water flows, and it's caused me some issues when we have heavy rains a couple of times, and the property owner tried to do something a little different to help, but still.

**Speaker 10:** I mean, it's a huge conversation, and it's hard to have because it includes a lot of property rights and stuff like that. How do you zone up a town that benefits? How do you zone up a town that benefits everyone in the town, and not just a handful of people? But it's a hard conversation to have because everyone wants to do whatever they want to on their own property. It's complicated.

**Speaker 29:** Not tonight's decision.

**Speaker 10:** No. Definitely something we need to talk about. We definitely got farther into the conversation with the roads tonight than we have in a long time, but it's definitely something that we need to get deeper in on the planning board probably, especially. We're segmenting off this town. Probably. It needs to be zoned in different ways than it is right now, where we just say, okay, two acres here, five acres here, and one acre here, and that's it. We've blanketed it across the board, and it's probably not really the right way to do it, but huge conversations.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Anything else on roads, Dave? No. Okay. Recycling.

**Speaker 12:** There was a mess up there a week or so ago. They brought a 40-yard recycling. So anybody that went up there and said, I probably couldn't throw the recycling out of the field. Let's say they had gotten so far behind that somebody from their Rutland office had to come down and they brought a 40-yarder, which was almost unusable. Then they didn't have to do the compact or anything until that Saturday morning, too, which both were supposed to be done on Thursday because I had called them on Monday. But they made a call the following Monday. They switched out the 40-yarder for the 30-yarder by Wednesday, so that got taken care of. And they actually re-emptied the compactor, which they didn't need to, but they did because they had screwed up. They wanted to make sure that everything was emptied.

**Speaker 15:** I have a question on recycling. Do we know, so it goes up to Rutland, do we know where it goes from there?

**Speaker 12:** Well, it doesn't usually go to Rutland. They had to send something from Rutland down. Because they were so far behind. So it was going from town, but that facility was closed.

**Speaker 15:** But then where does it go? Because China's not taking recycling anymore. They're not taking any of the U.S.'s garbage. So I'm wondering, you know, we had this situation out in Arizona where it was this big scam. You pay a bunch of money for recycling, and gee, it ends up in your landfill. So I'm just curious. If we ever follow. If we ever follow the chain to see where all of this does go, because, you know.

**Speaker 10:** It's the part we don't talk about, doesn't it?

**Speaker 15:** Well, we should, because, you know, you want to do your part and make sure that you're separating things out. And it goes to the big corporation in the sky and, well, gee, money, I can't put it over there. How am I going to pay my bonus? So it just goes back into the landfill. So I'm just curious. I'd love to know. A lot of plastics are flowing out at sea. Oh, it totally goes out to sea.

Absolutely.

**Speaker 12:** Yeah. So what are we paying for? When it was canned, I didn't go to the facility and saw how they separated it all and they mailed it. And then people actually bought it from them.

**Speaker 11:** So people were paying.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** All metals still, that's their number one export to China. Number one export to China is scrap metal. We sell them our scrap metal. We buy finished. We buy that. The material is bad for them. Well, it's stupid because, but what it is, is we have, we deal with a country that has no regulations and they can do it less expensive with the barge and everything that we can come out of Detroit. That's why you need to put tariffs on things, but that's a political thing. But if you put tariffs on China and India, then it would be equal. You would see places out in Detroit. You would see Buffalo make it steel again, you know, and then we would be selling steel instead of buying steel, selling oil instead of buying oil, send them over there to be processed. Yeah, it's unbelievable how you can do that is send something all, all, all the way around the world, China's correction.

**Speaker 10:** Volkswagen right now, as we speak, they're bringing it Volkswagen to their knees right now.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah.

**Speaker 48:** So that's what's the number one power.

**Speaker 15:** I was just curious. If any,

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** if you watch over in China, the trash trucks back up to the Pacific ocean, dump them every minute of the day, every minute, they're dumping trash in the ocean and we're over here feeling good. Do we recycle? You're right. We don't know where it goes.

**Speaker 31:** We don't know where it goes.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Okay.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Well, Vermont just implemented another Vermont household hazards, waste law for more covered products and what it's going to be, it's when you buy these products, at the store, there's going to be a little increase because it's just like your paint program. They tax you a little bit more on the gallon of paint and then it goes from recycling to recycling.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Well, it's like when Bernie Sanders took the radiation waste out of the nuclear plant and he brought it right through this town, right through this town and went down to Texas. Everybody felt good, but it's down Texas now. It's not gone.

**Speaker 10:** I mean, there's a lot of feel good policies. There's probably only three people in the entire country that can actually tell you where it goes. I'd love to know. Nobody knows. I might. That might be my next thing.

**Speaker 15:** You let me know what they tell you.

**Speaker 49:** Call Paula Kamperman at BCRC.

**Speaker 15:** She's the recycling guru and she's the part of it.

**Speaker 50:** She'll tell me, oh, it goes up to, you know, I don't know.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** That's a better way to retrieve the petroleum back out of all these plastic products, right? Rather than just dumping them in the ocean. That'd be awesome, wouldn't it? Right, right. Yep. I knew a guy that wanted to do it. I knew one too. He's crazy.

**Speaker 15:** Yeah. Oh, yeah.

**Speaker 51:** Yeah.

**Speaker 10:** He was... He died. He was a guy. He was a guy. He was a guy.

**Speaker 27:** He was a guy.

**Speaker 10:** He was a genius.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** One of those geniuses. Crazy at the same time. Jimmy.

**Speaker 10:** Yep. He could do it.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** The guy you were talking about when we were on the... It's Jim Baker. Yeah. Same guy. On the Jeep. On the way back. Yeah.

**Speaker 42:** He actually had a company called New Earth Salvage where he was going to spin turbines by burning plastic milk jugs.

**Speaker 52:** Basically.

**Speaker 10:** Yeah. We went there. I went there. I went there. I went there. I went there. I went there. I went there. I went there. I went there. I went there.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I went there. I went there. I went there. You had a meeting with him? Yeah. Yeah. I had a meeting with him down in Mt. Tom. We had a big meeting. We had a state rep Dan Bosley and everybody with us. We went down, sat with the company and they said, this is unbelievable, this is the greatest idea we ever saw. Then they asked him how he came about the idea and that was the end of the meeting.

**Speaker 11:** Yeah.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I can only imagine. All natural.

**Speaker 12:** He's passed, so. I went to his house once and he lived in the attic and his horse lives in the battle.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** His horse was in the house. Yeah. I know people don't love horses but that's just a little crazy. Vote Annalie.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** They're all like that.

**Speaker 27:** he's like stop in for a beer and i'm like are you kidding me jim he was definitely a character

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** okay so i attended an alliance meeting yesterday on recycling and um our household hazardous waste facility in bennington got a couple dings because we didn't have a log inventory and a daily inspection checklist so they're working on that but other than that it's uh we're okay and it's only it hasn't really been operating one full year the the end of october um what's the other thing here a little slate of update um the alliance is working with bennington town of bennington their uh chamber of commerce any they're hoping to have this memorandum of understanding with any event put on by the bennington chamber of commerce which includes the garlic fest that any vendors will use compostable products uh first year it's there's some they're going to ask them to do it second year they may have a vendor that they can buy in bulk all from the same vendor and everybody uses same product it's still in the works but they're they want to keep a lot of the paper and not the paper but the plastics out of the landfill uh the bennington town committee compost committee or rinsing the plates people use before they went in the trash and i don't know that's not going to happen but that's something that's in the work that uh they're starting with the garlic fest because that's the biggest event that bennington has and they're going to just reach out county-wise i don't see it happening next year but any event that people put on town-wise you need recycle you need your compost you need trash and how to do all that stuff if you don't what happens i don't know but the memorandum of understanding there's a little bit of they're talking about a fine now they're going to tell the vendors who can't come next year that's what's in their understanding right now if it passes but it's still in the works and then bennington library is going to have fix it fun november 9th bring in any of your stuff that needs to be fixed i don't know what people are going to be there and what they're fixing but they said sewing machines your hammers trains, whatever. They'll fix it. And that's it. Your children, your husband. November 9th. Oh, that's it. Yeah, I didn't talk about that.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** One thing we won't be able to bring is wives, because that's unfixable.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** We are perfect as we are. Nothing else on recycling. Emergency management. Bill, you had something you wanted to bring up. I thought you were bringing up something about the fire truck.

**Speaker 29:** That's the next item.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Oh, sorry. Okay, nothing on emergency management. Fire truck loan.

**Speaker 29:** Fire truck loan. Went back to Adams Co-op. They're perfectly happy to write a loan for five years. If we want to pay interest only for one month to be able to pay interest but it won't reduce capital you know, if we got the truck in November and the first payment would fall due in December and if you don't want to make that and you want to just pay interest, they'll accommodate it. It doesn't make any good sense to us. You're still talking about a five year loan. We're within the range of what doesn't require bonding. They do not and they don't want to write loan papers until we need the money. Yeah. They feel as if it protects us as well as the bank for whatever interest rates change over the next two months. Paul's looking with the expectation that the truck will be available around Thanksgiving which might make a first payment due in December.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So we have enough for a first payment.

**Speaker 29:** We have money to cover well...

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** We might... I think the town's got enough money in the fire truck equipment replacement fund. But it looks like...

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** In this truck's fund.

**Speaker 29:** In this truck's fund. Yes. You might be able to steal money out of emergency management money. You might be able to steal money if you still got ARPA money that

**Speaker 53:** is uncommitted. I hate to

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** steal money out of Peter to pay

**Speaker 45:** Paul. I'd rather just hear it clean. Yeah, we've got it.

**Speaker 29:** That's only by December 31st. Right.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Anyhow. But the other thing is it's going to be figured like $60,000 a year repayment for five years for this loan. So there goes more tax money.

**Speaker 29:** So one comment we got Tracy from the bank who just assumed worked directly with Lori. At this point since we're termed and we know what's going on, there's no point in having to go through Paul or me to Lori. Turn around and go back to Tracy. So that's the intention of how it's going to be done. And that's as much as I have about the truck loan. It's going forward. It's agreed that they will write the loan.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Lori, delinquent dog

**Speaker 2:** update. So Luke has been working on trying to bring those dog owners into the lines. I did have one dog owner come in late this afternoon and license dog. Good. One of our dogs moved out of town a week or two ago. Good. And he did reach one who said that she would be in next week. So I mean we're still maybe at six or seven people who are holding out.

**Speaker 10:** Wow. Last year.

September six or seven people.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** We're done in November. Has Luke issued the tickets?

**Speaker 2:** I am not sure.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Alright. Do you want me to email him and say Luke if you issued the tickets, I need the copies back here in the office. Lori needs them in her records.

**Speaker 2:** I know he's been calling them and what not. I don't know.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Every time he does stuff like this he puts in a bill to us. He's working. He puts in a bill. I hope the tickets cover what you know it's costing the town. If not, we ought to look at that. Or send the tickets. This is one of the issues that just pisses me off because it's so little. It's just laziness. There's no way this is about

**Speaker 2:** financial work. The hard part with the ticket is the people can just accept the fine and pay the court and then the court gets the money and closes the case and they still haven't licensed the dog. So we don't get the money.

**Speaker 54:** We don't get the money.

**Speaker 10:** Like I said before, this is one of the things the state wants to take it over. Go ahead. Go and take the dog.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** But that doesn't make sense. This is the stuff that drives me nuts. How can we run our town, enforce people, punish people, whatever you want to call it, if we don't get the money? What good is it? It's a paper tiger.

**Speaker 8:** And if we're paying him to make these excessive phone calls. It was due January 1st. You had it on April to pay it and now here we are in September and he's billing us to remind people to do this. It's crazy.

**Speaker 29:** We could make better use of the kennels. Put the owners in. Yeah, exactly.

**Speaker 55:** Suck aids.

**Speaker 10:** Let's bring back suck aids. It's usually never a bad dog, right? No.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** How many dogs are out? How many people?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah. You know, I was always worried about putting our delinquent tax people's names out there. That's kind of sensitive. You might not have the money. You might fall into hardship. This is $10. $15 at the top?

**Speaker 19:** That many?

**Speaker 2:** Oh, God. We're down to seven people, nine dogs.

I think there should be a list in the table. Any more

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** teeth in the dog? We've done what the state said in our dog ordinance. Let's read them out.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I would never picture half of these people being Would you state who those people

**Speaker 29:** are, please?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** That's up to the chair.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I agree. Stacey Abusi, Sumner Road, has a dog. Dog's rabies expires September 2025, so all she needs to do is register her dog. Elin Bascom, she needs a rabies shot. Doreen Bentley needs a rabies shot. Megan Bouchard has two dogs. One needs a rabies shot. Ryan Clark, rabies shot. William Primmer, he could do the dog. It's okay. It's current. Clay Townsend Zeller, one dog needs a shot.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** How many dogs do you have? One or two? He has two and one needs a shot. So that's five dogs that need shots.

**Speaker 10:** That are running around. That's the whole purpose of this program. It's really scary.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** It's a public health issue. The whole purpose of the program is to make sure they have the shots.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** It's not the 10 bucks. Do we know anybody, the relatives, who can say,

**Speaker 1:** get your dog down there. Does the Townsend do the rabies clinic stuff? No. We have them up there. We have a central trackership.

That's why they go really close together. It's real cheap. Twice a month? Yeah. That's the treasure supply.

**Speaker 29:** Okay. Is there a point at which you can take the dog? Yeah. Because the other side, the liability side of it is, God forbid some kid gets bitten. There's no rabies protection on the animal. Who's responsible?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** We know about it.

**Speaker 29:** Yeah. We've been neglectful in our duty to let that animal still be young. Can you give this to me?

**Speaker 10:** Let's get Louie. We start getting into impounding dogs and it costs us a lot of cash.

**Speaker 41:** A lot of cash.

**Speaker 27:** We can't impound them.

**Speaker 10:** We only can keep two dogs. We could spend $20,000 on a blink of an eye on somebody's dog.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Well, maybe that's the next thread. He should say, we're taking your dog.

**Speaker 2:** Well, I remember when, I think it was Chris Dardew's chair, in the state law books you can send a warrant out with a sheriff and then the dog is humanely destroyed. We got to that point. Take your sheriff. We got to that point. And I had phone calls left at midnight from drunken people who were mad that we were coming after their dogs.

**Speaker 10:** I've literally read articles where towns are on the hook for $15,000 and $20,000 for people's dogs.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Just because they impounded the dog

**Speaker 10:** for one reason or another.

**Speaker 23:** Right, and people won't pay it.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But it says in the law, you've got to register your dog.

**Speaker 27:** You could put a lien on your house.

**Speaker 10:** How do you enforce them? I guess you could put a lien on their property. You're getting into a whole bunch of legalities. It's just craziness. The state should take over this whole entire program.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** And if you call the state right now,

**Speaker 10:** it's not a problem. I mean, you could bank up this whole town because someone's got a dog that they don't want to take care of.

**Speaker 56:** Literally.

**Speaker 22:** It's like ASPCA or something. Isn't that a form of neglect?

**Speaker 10:** Possibly.

**Speaker 57:** Well, they're so crowded.

**Speaker 22:** Yeah, they're crowded, but they've got to go out and look

**Speaker 56:** if there's a report.

**Speaker 10:** They'll go out and look, but they may say

**Speaker 57:** it's on the house of the dog you guys got.

**Speaker 22:** I don't know. One of my daughter-in-laws used to work for the ASCPA in Boston. And she used to go out with police and other officers there to bring dogs in, take them away from the owner.

**Speaker 10:** If there's no room to keep the dog at their shelter or whatever, then it's on the town.

**Speaker 41:** I know Luke had a real tough time

**Speaker 10:** finding a place to bring dogs. That's why we got the kennel.

**Speaker 22:** But the other option is just let them go. So we're going to be liable

**Speaker 29:** either way. I mean, long term, there's the hope. North Adams is apparently building a shelter

**Speaker 58:** with a lot more capacity than Payne.

**Speaker 22:** It looks nice.

**Speaker 59:** Pause something?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah, second. Well, I mean,

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I'd get Luke involved in this a lot and say let's just whatever our policy is, do it and do it quick. Because it's not only they're not registered, they don't have the rating shots, and there may be a provision that says that's more important.

**Speaker 13:** And nobody's dog died, right? I'm just saying. I've gotten things from you in the past

**Speaker 60:** and my dogs have died. Yeah, you'd think though if I sent you a letter

**Speaker 61:** with a fine, you'd say my dog died.

**Speaker 13:** They haven't responded, but other people continue to throw away and be like, oh my dog's dead.

**Speaker 61:** Right.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** After the fine goes out,

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But after ten phone calls, you'd say, oh, my dog died.

**Speaker 10:** That's all you need to say. I mean, no record of a rapee shot may actually mean that you,

**Speaker 27:** are we mandatory to confiscate that dog? You might be. That's what Bill's saying.

**Speaker 10:** We might be liable if we don't. If they don't have rabies shots, that might be more important to do.

**Speaker 27:** Well, I think our ordinance says

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** we go through the tort system. It'd be cheaper to go up there and just give it the rabies shot.

**Speaker 2:** Hire a vet and go up there and give it the rabies shot. Oh, yeah. That's one of the things I hate to do it

**Speaker 62:** because everybody would want it,

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** but here's your $15. Now, go up there and give it the rabies shot. That's one of the things I hate to do because everybody would want it. Go register your dog. Give it a shot.

**Speaker 63:** Yes, it's the vet bill.

**Speaker 52:** I guess.

**Speaker 42:** But like you said, it costs more. You can get a rabies shot.

**Speaker 10:** It'd be cheaper for us to pay for it as a town and go right to their house and give them the rabies shot than it is to take that dog

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** and put it in our kennel.

**Speaker 19:** Well, then we'll be doing everybody's, too.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Then we'll just waste taxes to pay for all the dogs

**Speaker 29:** and see what people say. That's right. You put in the rabies shot and put it in the town. Yeah. You put it in the select board minutes. If you need to, you create a category in the town report.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah. Money dispersed because of that. Public shaming.

**Speaker 41:** That's what it is.

**Speaker 10:** Put it on their tax bill.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Right, but then don't get them the shots. That's the big thing. Oh, if we had to go get them a shot, yeah.

**Speaker 64:** Put it on their tax bill.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yep. And 8%? That's a big bounty when you miss that.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Okay. Laurie, you call Luke tomorrow and got to do this.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** We got to do something. If this doesn't work, we got to look at this, too.

**Speaker 12:** I mean, we've had to do that with people that won't change their driveway color. Ultimately, we go around and around and then we do it and we go.

**Speaker 11:** Right.

**Speaker 12:** This is more of a public health issue than a color.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Right, we're going to take your dog, we're bringing them

**Speaker 22:** and give them a shot.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Charge them 100 bucks.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yep, so here it is. Yep. You want to foster another dog?

**Speaker 32:** No.

**Speaker 22:** Oh, you were looking for some dogs, weren't you?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** We got one coming. I appreciate it, but we got one coming.

**Speaker 22:** Maybe you want a couple to keep them company. How about a wolf pair for you?

**Speaker 32:** Yeah, that'd be good.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Okay, town website.

**Speaker 2:** Laurie. So, I guess I just wanted to make you aware the state updated their laws recently and said words like you have to know, put the audio files of your meeting either video or audio has to go on your website. The file is so large that our website man had extreme trouble getting it to load. And I couldn't email it to him for him to try because it is too large to send by email. What it means is the storage capacity that we pay for on the website is probably going to end up being a problem. You either have to pay more money for the website the other thing he suggested was paying for like cloud storage and you just put a link on your website and now we're paying for all these files to be stored

**Speaker 65:** somewhere.

**Speaker 10:** So is it now mandatory that we record the meeting?

**Speaker 2:** It's mandatory. It was optional at one time. It was optional and just for the minutes but now audio or video

**Speaker 54:** something has to go on the minute.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I was going to ask you is it mandatory in the first place

**Speaker 13:** to record?

**Speaker 60:** It wasn't mandatory last year.

**Speaker 61:** So could it just be a link

**Speaker 2:** to the YouTube channel? Like why do we have to that can't be official.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I know the school wasn't doing it last year.

**Speaker 2:** If they have an official website they have to have it.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So if we put a link on our website what's that?

**Speaker 2:** Library So if there's a link

**Speaker 62:** on our website

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** to the cloud can you put it up there or does our webmaster put it up there? I think that

**Speaker 2:** I've never done it before I'm assuming that I would have access to the cloud and put things up there.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Because all you need to do

**Speaker 28:** is keep it up there 30 days, right?

**Speaker 2:** Well 30 days from when

**Speaker 66:** It's in one of the cumulus clouds

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** That's all mine is My email is all my storage is Gmail cloud I would never be able to store everything

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So find out the price of that

**Speaker 2:** Every third meeting I could get rid of the first But you'll have to keep at least two, maybe three meetings I wonder if you could

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I was going to say if you could tell how many people but it doesn't matter

**Speaker 19:** It's got to be that

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I personally think the open meeting should be The door Exactly, come to the meetings Because you can't You listen to that and you can't interact Or you may not know

who's speaking He has these videos on his computer all of them on his laptop at home

**Speaker 13:** Well I can store them

**Speaker 2:** on my computer here But what we pay for on our website just doesn't include that amount of data So we kind of I mean the last time the state started dictating you all just said

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** no more website, we're done Well this is where we were talking Dave says it changes laws now it changes laws pretty soon they're going to want a year's worth, pretty soon they're going to want more and more

**Speaker 19:** but they don't throw any money that way

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** More demands on the towns

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** and we have to follow through

**Speaker 29:** That's what Kurt said If you want to take over, go ahead You ask them where the state website is that you'd like us to store it

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Right, there you go

**Speaker 23:** That's a great idea

**Speaker 19:** We don't have the capacity

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Ok, let us know what's going on then Sign two deeds transferring lot 294 and lot 188 and these we approve Many months ago

**Speaker 2:** and I'm glad that Yes, one of them recently and one of them a long time ago He said he sent the check and it must have been lost in the mail Then he found the check under his wife's seat

**Speaker 3:** in her car

**Speaker 67:** Maybe she didn't want to buy the land

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** She's wondering how she could transfer those

**Speaker 2:** Yeah, yeah

So yeah

**Speaker 2:** We're ready to sign both deeds

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So that means Alright, we only have We only own a half of Alcon Wall lot and if we can see who owns the other half maybe we could get rid of that too Because at one time we had about 50 or 60 Alcon Wall lots that we took at tax sale and we're trying to get them back on the tax roll

**Speaker 15:** They're building up there

**Speaker 49:** Oh, we went

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** My husband and I went up there the other day Of course we got lost a couple of times How can you not? He says I'm getting out of here We didn't see the whole Alcon Wall Beautiful homes up there

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** It's like going into a whole different world You go there, every time you go

**Speaker 29:** you just go a different way Do people see these things walking?

**Speaker 53:** What's that?

**Speaker 29:** I know, we used to go swimming there It used to be a challenge to find out where the hell the property is Never mind measurement to get a number

**Speaker 15:** Exactly, the one that you And then they said

No problem, we've marked the driveways Bullshit, they're one marker state I know, yeah That'll give you a beginning

**Speaker 29:** The house is marked There's a couple of flags out in the woods

**Speaker 68:** I had to

**Speaker 15:** I had to go back down to where I had service so I could go on the Alcon Wall map to figure out where to go further Absolutely, I could drive down to Cleft Road Oh okay, I was just there Oh, it's across from lot 401 which had a for sale sign Okay, now I went back up there and put the fee up

**Speaker 29:** And I'm working from a complete subdivision map of the whole place Of course, it's interesting because some people use the original lot subdivision number some people have a street number

**Speaker 15:** They go nowhere

**Speaker 31:** You just turn around

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah, you go around Where does this go? It doesn't go anywhere

**Speaker 29:** There's no sign says that The best part is you want to drive a fire engine there in the middle of the night preferably in winter When Craig has or has not gotten there to sand the roads and you look for a bright light burning

**Speaker 69:** And you can't get there

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** It's horrible It's right over that side but you gotta go down here, go up this road, up around

**Speaker 23:** Okay

**Speaker 2:** Lori, what else do you have? Well, it's funny that we talked about this This new excess weight permit came in today Oh I thought they gave us one last week

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I would have thought so too

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So that must have some nice content

**Speaker 23:** Oh, don't sign it

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But I thought they gave it to us last week See No, that was Beacon Acquisitions

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** So they gave us this after they started

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Oh, yeah, clearly Holly Higgum, okay

**Speaker 22:** So I have an email address Is that the one that's working on the Yeah, the white trucks I talked to a bunch of those guys last week

**Speaker 32:** Well, Holly must be

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** She's gotta be with the insurance I have it here Yeah

Riggs is in Phoenix Holly what's her name?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I think she's with the insurance

**Speaker 1:** The closest is in Jacksonville I believe

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I have an email Riggs, this is Riggs I mean, I just would like to Like you said, what are you gonna do for the damage to your road I can fix anything

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Utility and emergency vehicles

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** are exempt Kind of push them a little I do think we're gonna sign this There you go

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Am I signing this, guys?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Sure

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Are you gonna do a motion?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Sure I'm not here to sign it

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I didn't read it

**Speaker 20:** Riggs, just learned the overweight permit

**Speaker 21:** Ten dollars

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Did they give us the check?

**Speaker 24:** Yeah

**Speaker 10:** Ten bucks won't cover the road damage

**Speaker 70:** No, because you're the insurance company

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** With that one inch That's right, that is a good thing to sign Now we have to John Doherty

**Speaker 8:** Who says the excess weight fee is ten dollars

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** State of Vermont It's been ten dollars as long as I've been here

**Speaker 12:** Most people, most counties have gotten rid of that

**Speaker 11:** We don't, mandated

**Speaker 12:** We just take it

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** And it's for Two million Dave, what is

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Four million

**Speaker 30:** What are our bridges

**Speaker 15:** rated for

**Speaker 12:** Going up Mill Road Well, I mean, they're legally posted at the end of the road For the axles

**Speaker 22:** For the vehicles

**Speaker 12:** That they get in an accident Right, okay

**Speaker 15:** I mean, the regulations Yeah I would say they're not over Like, even those forwarders I mean, what do they have, eight?

**Speaker 22:** They're sticking all those Because I was talking about Well, one guy was throwing out Well, and it's per axle So it's all ready And he hit the mark So they are trying to do everything to fix it Yeah, okay

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Because he asked me He said, you know, there's a We should reach out To say, hey, you got to get those

**Speaker 71:** I mean, they were mining

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** To a whole other place And have people with radios Right, they should have At least they should Do some safety You know, I would When we reach out to them It's a safety thing You have the flaggers

**Speaker 23:** You know, some kind of caution

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Some of the drivers Are a little bit fast

**Speaker 1:** Tell them to push one of our Locals off the road

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I came down The pickup truck went up there Yeah, that's what I said

**Speaker 72:** They go up and down that road

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Pretty fast Local Joe And I had my jeep Drop down You know, I don't go fast enough That's why it's

**Speaker 22:** I thought it was

**Speaker 34:** Under correspondence

**Speaker 73:** Okay, old business Yep

**Speaker 2:** Kurt had made the motion At the last meeting to do the permit For the sign So I have the permit ready The check made out from the community Building community group But if you guys want to review it

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** And sign it Because this is what we decided on I know one of them that Is going to be at the campus library And it's going to be that

**Speaker 1:** All the way across, right? 54 by 30 or something like that 11.25 square feet

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** 54 by 30, 11.25 Okay Submit it

**Speaker 15:** How far from the center

**Speaker 51:** We have to draw in there

**Speaker 10:** How far away from the road we are

**Speaker 2:** It has to be at least 50 feet In And we should mark it

**Speaker 15:** So it's not going to be where All the flowers are So all those have to be dug up?

**Speaker 36:** No

**Speaker 12:** Probably should ask Pam If she wants her flowers

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I don't think she wants them Tom paid for them Community group Community group paid for them I think she donated Oh maybe her time

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But the plants themselves

**Speaker 74:** Some of them are low enough

**Speaker 1:** Because they look like they can Those big colored orange yellow And then you just put them

**Speaker 10:** Somewhere else in the school yard But the kids transplant them They'll come back every year Well we can ask her But I don't think she's going to want them

**Speaker 1:** But yeah we should probably Put some markings out there

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Where the signs are going to go Make sure it's marked

**Speaker 15:** Make it 50 and a half Yeah please

**Speaker 37:** I do 51 but

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah 51 is good Other old business Laurie

**Speaker 2:** Nothing from me Oh I do have something Um I spoke to you at a meeting or two before About the problems I'm having with the CDL Drug testing stuff We sent a nice little Email to The drug testing people I had no response From them I did forward it to our insurance guy Wade Mesher At VLCT Made aware of this problem From the drug testing company themselves The first few days of August If all goes as planned Things should be back to normal Around mid September But that's all he said And then yesterday Maybe the day before I got a new reminder that Everything needs to be done Through Southwestern Vermont Medical Center So they're not Willing to work with us Testing people We have two tests

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** That we have this quarter

**Speaker 44:** Do you have tests?

**Speaker 2:** Right yeah Is that where it can be done?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Confidentially

**Speaker 2:** It's called confidential If we were to have two tests This quarter They have to be done by September 30th And our employees would At this point have to go all the way

**Speaker 29:** To Southwestern Vermont Medical Center That's where they've chosen

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah but Are they the CDL certified Collector

**Speaker 29:** That's Southern Vermont

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Yeah but they have to be the

**Speaker 20:** Collector

**Speaker 12:** Either way they have to be

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Home to the garage like they normally do Right and they said by mid September So we can play the

**Speaker 11:** If we have tests coming up

**Speaker 12:** Normally what happens is Where he calls me on the day before And says hey you gotta be at the garage At this time Okay so that works in the winter But there's a storm And she called me the day before And says hey guess what You gotta go to the hospital tomorrow Cause you're gonna have to set that up

**Speaker 2:** What if you're sick?

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** You have to make an appointment

**Speaker 12:** What if you don't make it?

**Speaker 2:** Something happened Then you gotta go the very next day So You didn't say you were off the hook You didn't say anything But they sent another They sent another reminder about This is where you need to go

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** That's probably all In their computer He hasn't been there by the 15th of September So they push the button and send another Reminder So what do we do?

**Speaker 40:** It's only if they call for it right?

**Speaker 1:** It's like a Unknown test they don't know

**Speaker 74:** It's a random

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** But he's called

**Speaker 12:** I get it a few times a year anyway Four times a year or better

**Speaker 2:** So at the beginning of the quarter If our guys are picked I just receive a notice that One of our guys has been chosen Or both of our guys have been chosen But then I don't hear anything Until it's time to schedule it And when they know they're gonna be in our area They'll call me on Monday Saying we're gonna be here on

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Tomorrow or Wednesday to schedule it And they can take your CBL license away from you

**Speaker 21:** No

**Speaker 12:** What can they do to you? I mean this is to our insurance This isn't the federal program We've been doing this for 20 years And I haven't gotten it

**Speaker 75:** This is just our insurance company doing it

**Speaker 2:** But it is a federal They're putting you in the federal testing program So it'll have federal effects For noncompliance

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I don't think they pull their CBL right away There's a way to work with them Do you need

**Speaker 20:** Counseling

**Speaker 12:** I'm not told to go That's the thing If you fail it you have to You get help The whole thing's a joke

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Well There's some employees that Are going to fail Here? No not here We're not testing the slack board Don't worry about it Not here Not here

Okay

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** So do we just Kind of ignore them

**Speaker 3:** Or

**Speaker 2:** If it's needed I have to schedule it

**Speaker 12:** Yeah so they haven't really even said

**Speaker 21:** Whether you have to or haven't

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** I went back and said we can't do this We can't do this We're a two man operation

**Speaker 23:** We can't have our guys out

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Go back and say we're going to wait until your mobile

**Speaker 11:** We're behind as it is on our duties

**Speaker 12:** You're probably going to have to call Wait and then you say hey What's the scope If you tell me this they're still telling me that

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Maybe you have to be crabby and call them And say we're not doing it until your mobile unit Is up and running

**Speaker 2:** Yeah we can be crabby

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Good?

**Speaker 12:** Good try The best part is that the person that comes down And gives you the test doesn't even have to do it Themselves Because I question that because the guy that Came to give me the test one day I was pretty sure Was I as a guy I said do they make you do this He started laughing and said No I don't have to pass any of that I'm putting this in your hands Right To trust you that you're not going to Tamper with something He's going to turn around and think about it

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Yeah he's like oh I got a good one here

**Speaker 12:** Oh I got a good one here I can use this

Ah Yeah apparently

**Speaker 12:** So I mean

**Speaker 2:** Our teachers are going to get tested And they take care of our students every day That's true

**Speaker 10:** Fewer people are going to test it all the time The teachers can I mean the reason truckers like UKL And I think that they're going to Get tested for marijuana

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** What else What else do you have Laurie

**Speaker 10:** What else they got

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Anybody apply for DB Fiber No Do you want to work together Ready Just in case What do you have for new business

**Speaker 2:** Nothing for me

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Use of school facility form Um I requested the first, all first and third Thursdays of each month, beginning September 2024 through August 2025, 6 to 9 p.m. in case there is a, our attendance here exceeds the seating capacity of the town office, that we can use the town multi-purpose room. Sounds right. And you were approved, right? Yes, we were approved. Um, Lori sent us a, what is it, Vermont 250 Anniversary Commission Party Declaration of Independence is coming in 2025, and the state would like all communities to participate somehow, whether it's big, small, so if anybody from Stamford is interested.

**Speaker 10:** 25 or 26.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Uh, starting in 25, finishing in 27. So we have a couple years to do a party.

We're celebrating the $220. $220. Yeah, it's like. Either it's $250 or not, you know? It's a three-year celebration. Yep. Sounds like the tower is pretty. Oh.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** It's almost as long as the revolution of today, tomorrow, this year. Campaign 25.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** It's almost as long as the whole war for independence.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Well, it took a couple years, you know, so.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** You think we should shoot some fireworks off, or some fountains, or something?

**Speaker 29:** Good.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Okay, um.

**Speaker 29:** Does that mean we can get new funny license plates?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Maybe. Oh, boy. Oh, God. Um.

**Speaker 10:** A dollar looks just like a quarter.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** On Wednesday, September 18th, 10 to 1130, there's going to be a VLCT budgeting, spending, and borrowing seminar. Yeah. Yeah. I'd like to sign up for it, if you can have it here at the town office. Yep.

**Speaker 10:** What was that one?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Budgeting, spending, and borrowing. It's 10 to 1130 on Wednesday, September 18th.

**Speaker 2:** Maybe we'll learn how to do bonding for payment.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Mm-hmm. Yep. Any other new business, old business guys? Okay. And I'd like to make a motion to go into executive session for legal matters and personnel. Second.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** All in favor?

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** Aye.

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** Aye.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** I just want to mention, anybody who knows Cindy Candelora, there's going to be a spaghetti supper Saturday night. Oh, how is she doing? She's home. I know she had her last operation. Well, not last, but another operation a couple weeks ago on her hand. Mm-hmm. It's going to be a long road. Yeah. She'll be at the dinner. Yep. She will? Yeah.

**Speaker 1:** I'm thinking. It's for her, right? Yeah, she will. I think she's tough. She's tough. She's tough. Yeah. Yeah.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Yes, Jennifer, can I have your... Really, go ahead. Your flag right off. Good night. Good night. Thank you, Dave. Good night, Dave. Maybe one day, you know, first one. One day. I'm sorry, can we go land? But she's coming and going. Maybe just for a second. She's going to be in her place and... I guess, the question is if she's getting a free pass. That's true. Yeah. Can we have any... Yeah. I don't know. Does she have you in the feed? Did they ignore it? No. I don't know. Yeah.

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** it motion to come out of executive session second all in favor uh the executive session we're just going to invite sally gold to the next meeting nothing else what do we do

**Speaker 76:** oh rate for the uh new hire does that number have to be public okay

**Speaker 62:** we don't mention nothing about the lane sale right no no and now that we're back in open

**Speaker 2:** meeting i should have mentioned before that i received theresa's official resignation letter

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** today don't accept it the select board should happens if you say no thank her definitely yes definitely definitely would regret that she's leaving and i like this stuff like we do everybody

**Nancy L. Bushika (Chair):** else would you send her a nice letter and give her a hug

**Michael G. Denault (inferred):** i'll tell you what i'll take good care of her give her a raise at home

**Speaker 22:** yeah all right motion to adjourn motion to adjourn second second all favor aye